I included the clause “The LISTING AGENT will keep detailed account of the amount of mileage incurred traveling to my house and his office” because of one simple reason. Time and time again we run into listing agents who have no idea as to the condition of the property. In fact we just put an offer on a triplex that the agent said was boarded and vacant and we went by it was anything but. It was unsecured and in fact had vagrants.

So what we have been finding is agents who have been taking listings and never even seeing the properties that they are selling. And many more who take a listing and never bother to ever go back by a property. We met one owner out at a property and he was surprised that the bank had taken posession of the property becaus eof the abandonement clause in the mortgage and had changed the locks and the agent never even knew. When told he basically said oh well…

So I think it is incumbent on an agent to actually show an interest in the property. I can’t tell you how many deals we have taken from agents by doing one simple thing.

We simply ask the owner how often they have heard from their agent and how many times he or she has even visited the property. Or we show them an empty flier box. When you provide good service it’s real easy to beat your competition who finds things to be “tedious” when they stand to make so much money.

So when we walk in and say we’ll actually BUY the property..not list it…and show them an army of people working to get the property sold…it makes for easy pickings.

I have gone ahead and downloaded your addendum as I think it will make a great marketing tool.
Thanks.

You are correct..lawyers have their problems as well. No doubt about it. I just hink there are WAY too many bad agents stinking up the joint for the good ones. It’s not the industry that is too blame..it’s these unprofessionals screweing it up for everybody.

I love real estate and it’s the business I have chosen. I have enjoyed successes and in turn had some down points as well..but I would not want to be doing anthing else…except maybe playing lead guitar for the Scorpions! Always wanted to be a rockstar!

Short Sales, auctions, REO’s…they will be around all year and those who know about them will profit and those who don..well it will be tough.

Then the market will change and we’ll have to adapt again. Just to let you know we are not Johnny Come Lately’s. We have been involved in real estate for 10 nyears now and we are constantly learning and improving our ability to succeed in this business.

Not being a real estate agent was a choice we made when we began as the fredom we have to succeed in this business is much greater.

I wish you well and let’s talk business..always looking for good deals and great people to work with and you are most assuredly one of the good guys!

Let’s look at some deals..and if you think I am tough on real estate agents now…wait until we do some business..LOL!

My point was, You’ve been taking on the Real Estate (Realtor) profession of late -pretty hard, and I thought it fair to take on your profession a bit, in the same way… Using your Addendum as a template to “mesh” against.

O.K. this post end up being 1860 words… If it’s too short then the meaning can be misconstrued. You had a good length in a reply -I thought I owed you the same deference. I’ve run this post across some people in the industry and they still think it’s a great read… But I’ll say it is long.

I think the Realtors get a bit defensive and I think you did just now too, in your post. You literally defended your seminars (and did some name calling in the process). Lately in your “rants” against the Realtors, you seemed to be biting the hand that fed you as I think 90% of the class were Realtors -when I took the class. But I know you are -moving on- to the broader population now and have taken a different tone.

No I’m not who you think I am. I or my staff have never been told what you said, -that I know about.

Since my post was really to point out that Lawyers do business is a way that is totally void of accountability or a “quid pro quo” results based / fee for positive outcome. But no outcry against changing that / having them go the way of the buggy whip. It has some similarities to real estate in the business model (i.e. % fee of the gross outcome)

I’m not using a fake name. Does everyone who posts HAVE to sign in using their FULL real name? You don’t look like Einstein with your tongue sticking out. Yet you represented yourself on the forum as that avatar. -NO big deal, I don’t think it matters -as to the content-. In my case, I don’t have blog where I’m out on the net having opinions all day long & I didn’t want to become a lightning rod for any attorney that may want to harass me on that point / start a malpractice lawsuit against any of my past clients… TO HARRASS –as you say the winner doesn’t matter. Ever tried to fight a law firm? Not fun. They own the access -and the means- to play in their arena…

In a way like the MLS! -but the state regulates who can practice Real Estate, by licensing the professional (their words not mine) to protect the public from the “wild west” days before their were licenses. The exclusivity of the business model as it stands now is partially the outcome of not allowing unlicensed, untrained individuals to practice Real Estate for $$ to the general public. Again, like Law, you can’t practice without a license. Both are licensed activities to “protect the public.”

YOU THINK IT”S BAD NOW!? Imagine “buggy whip days” in the future -where your dream of the EXSTINCT Realtor has come true… in which there is no regulation, no standardized contracts, no oversight, no fund for those that have been harmed by a licensee. No review board. No code of misconduct fines or code of ethics, No felony for practicing without a license. Just the professional investors, Builders and Banks using sophisticated contracts with sophisticated one sided disclaimers with the simple caveat “-get an LICENSED ATTORNEY or LICENSED CPA to interpret -if this legally binding contract is not fully understood.”

Would that really be a better future for the public or for keeping “the best interest at heart for our clients?”

No I’m personally not comparing my self to an attorney. I don’t play one on T.V. either. I was simply trying to draw a parallel in terms of a piece of the clients pie for a successful out come as a % range. Realtors can do all the marketing & time and leg work, on their dime -and still do ALL the work- and still not get paid A DIME – Which really is a stupid business model! Who other profession do you know of that does ALL the work first, and may not get paid for it, as a fairly mainstream job? Whereas Lawyers would definitely get reimbursed PLUS paid, and can, -IN ADDITION-, get a much higher % take of the pie, upon a successful outcome. What would that look like in the Real Estate industry? the commenter after my 1st post summed the idea up very well.

To clear the air, Let me say that I loved your class. I think you both REALLY covered a lot of subject matter in a short amount of time and did a great job. I agree, and believe, you prob have never had a request for a refund. Although, you didn’t get back to me 2 times with 2 questions I had (posted to the forum-) you have MORE THAN MADE UP FOR IT in the other times you have answered my questions. I would GLADLY wait more than 3 hours for a reply from you because I know you are busy and I’m not your only client. And I’m not mad and I understand that you didn’t reply. NO biggie! I was simply trying to say that the 3 hour return call thing (in your addendum) might be one example where it’s a bit much to CANCEL the contract over.

No I’m not actually disputing the credit card charge… and I don’t want a refund. It was an example to try and make a point. But it’s not the same to compare what you do for a 150 people simultaneously with a money back guarantee of a couple hundred $ and no 1:1 time. Try upping the stakes a bit -with thousands of your own money bet on an individual outcome, and having the client owe you a 60 thousand dollar commission. After spending 160 hours on it. Now you want a money back guarantee? Well you GET IT if it doesn’t sell! But what if it does? The fee is not justified?

I’d have more respect for your opinion if you had actually BEEN a Realtor for a year or more. Observing it from the outside makes you think you know it. Even your wife (or the other Barry’s wife) being a Realtor may make think you know it really well. -I’d love to be your Realtor because you BUY ALL THE TIME and that is a steady stream of income. Heck, I think we all decided to become Realtors after watching our Realtor and thinking “it’s so easy!” Walking that mile in those moccasins… then you can chime in with more authority…

Funny that there is a “10% finders fee” for putting people / businesses together in business. And yet 3% of a 6% split seems outrageous. There is an old saying in real estate: You don’t get paid for the ones that sell, you get paid for all the ones that don’t”

In your Blog/Forum you invite people to comment and have opinions. I think most would agree controversy sells in this medium -which is perhaps why your preaching rants (against the choir) have become more spirited and more frequent lately? More eyeballs means more revenue from your online ads, and I knew you “got your doors blown off” by the Ashley Qualls story. Her biz and her business model wouldn’t have escaped you either, as you are very impressive entrepreneurs.

Is it O.K. to disagree with you? I’m not a big fan of the name calling and I was surprised you felt you needed to add that to your comments.
In my post I didn’t claim that your comments/ideas were “inane”
Nor did I make broad accusations about your motives for your new business direction or say something like, “Unlike you, in your real estate business, we sincerely have our client’s best interests at heart.” Are you implying anyone who disagrees with parts of your addendum doesn’t have their clients best interests at heart? How do you presume you know anything about my interests with my clients? This is a blog/ forum… there are & will be differing opinions. Could I not make it up in other areas and still have my clients best interests in mind? In explaining your ideas is it necessary to insult me, my personal character, my industry and my individual business, in explaining your opinions?

You write that I have “an obvious inflated sense of self worth.” <- Again for disagreeing with you and trying to talk about the legal professional as it relates to a percentage of the deal? I was comparing the Real Estate commission structure to the commission structure of Lawyers as a semi established, percentage based, business model.

Since they are both % based and the range of which is commonly known. No where did I say I was personally worth anything in particular. I was talking about the industry, and your attack on the worth of commissions/industry and your addendum as an idea you had for fixing it. Most people understand that law firms -get Billions because their clients died from smoking. Seems a bit high as a fee, taken from the people who HAVE BEEN THROUGH the actual pain and suffering of death. -Could any of them justify that kind of –thousands- of millions of dollars (Billions) fee in those cases? Isn’t the judgment really based on the fact that smoking is addictive and the people died from it? Billions! Really? Attorneys deserve that 33%-50%?

Parts of your addendum are good ideas… But I wanted to point out loopholes that I believe make it one sided, and unfair. But perhaps I should have factored in you’re recommending the public recording of your agreement(s) as a (potential) lien (to insure enforcement). Although, that might raise an eyebrow with the public as why you need to do this if you “just have their best interests at heart.”

My post wasn’t about me and my services and about me justifying my commission. I was comparing industries. Since YOU were taking on an industry. Since you take on one I was pointing out it’s not as bad as another that is in the public eye -as well.

But since you attacked me, I’ll defend myself a bit. I believe I do provide a good value as evidenced as I’m still in business. I do some things for the clients that NO ONE else in the industry is doing. And I know they are of tremendous value because I’ve heard that time and time again from both Clients AND the public that are transacting with me. I can provide testimonials, etc… (as you do above in your defense of your seminars.)

What are these things I do that get me 6-7% and are justified at commanding 6-7%???

Well… I’ll quote you from your latest post… In NOT saying… You wrote- [And no…I can’t give you our marketing plan, it is proprietary]

Hey I enjoy the debate. Regardless keep up the good work. Even if you dislike our profession, we’ll still be here and still be defending it. It’s been around longer than the buggy whips have been gone…

And around longer than the short sale / real estate seminar business has been here…

I bet you thought becasue you wrote something “personal” that I would delete this post. Nope..going to answer it head on.

The seminars that we produce are thought by those who have taken them to be the most informative seminars on the market today. We have, in fact, been told by many that it is the best seminar they have ever taken. To attest to that I could literally give you hundreds of names.

I stand behind our seminars and we have NEVER, ever had a single refund request or complaint. In fact many of our attendees have taken the seminar 3 and 4 times to help assimilate the information provided. We are talking thousands of students across the Country and if we were asked for references, as we have been, I could give plenty.

We have been asked to speak and teach by numerous Board of Realtor organizations and have successfully taught local office groups as well. Our student base is national in scope and many have chosen to enroll in our personal coaching programs as well.

We have students, who have completed as many as 30 transactions after taking our class. We have attorney’s who from being associated with our class have had to hire additional staff to handle the workload being given to them from our students across the Country.

You see Mr. McNeal, I have no problem standing behind our classes and the information we teach and we have taught THOUSANDS of alumni from across the Country.

Now to your second part..can I say that everyone has become a millionaire, I doubt it. But I can absolutely be sure they were given the tools to do so.

I doubt for a second that you emailed me and did not receive a reply, all of our questions are answered via email or by open forum for all succedding similar questions to be answered. If you are who I think you are, you were told by staff that your questions had gotten to the point where you wanted someone to run your business for you and you were instructed to sign up for a personal coaching program which you unfortunately could not afford.

No seminar guarantees the future success of an attendee simply by showing up. You need to be able to competently apply the precepts as shown and in the procedural manner the process is to be applied to generate the level of success you desire.

How’s this Mr. McNeal, if you can show me that you followed what was taught, marketed as directed and were not able to succeed in executing a short sale I would gladly refund your money. You can send me your short sale package that you put together for a deal that was refused and if it is as we instructed and the bank that you submitted it to denied it, I will refund your money. Please send your completed package and any and all correspondence from the foreclosing lender to questions@realestateradiousa.com

I think that provides you with ample opportunity to prove your point. I’ll await your package. If you or anyone else thinks what we write on our blog is grandstanding, rest assured I have no problem in accepting a challenge. Unlike you in your real estate business, we sincerely have our client’s best interests at heart.

It is obvious with your inflated sense of self-worth (shown by comparing your business to that of a trial lawyer suing big tobacco) is why you think you are worth 6%, that’s fine and I applaud you.

I just feel that you should let your client know what they will be getting for that 6%. Obviously you can’t other than sounding like a commercial and saying I am worth it. Hey if it works for you, more power to you.

I doubt it will for much longer. Enjoy the ride.

I am in the business of marketing homes, so why not charge accordingly?

You guys just forgot to add in an hourly rate to the expense report. My rate would be $250 an hour for my marketing expertise. I would be paid whether the property sells or not.

On each property, I estimate I would make at least $7,000 in the first two weeks marketing the property and then at least $1,000 a week. And all my overhead and out-of-pocket expenses would be covered by the seller. I’d sign that agreement.

Why?

Take Attorney’s. Imagine…
List your cases, outcome etc. I’d love 1.d to be Tell me how much you told the client your legal services would cost and what they actually ended up costing. <-Ever hired an attorney? The hours just keep piling on…

And did you win or loose?
Doesn’t matter -they get paid the same anyway… They get actual expenses AND and HUGE hourly rate But now if they WIN for you AND get a judgment instead of taking 2-7% of YOUR total?

Try 33%-50% of what YOU are entitled to!

Multi Millions or Billions in earned fees? Sound reasonable on one case? For Smoking Deaths or class action suits? They are getting it.

From your addendum -the communication Liability:
Ever try to talk to your Attorney? Call me back in 3 hours or I owe you nothing? I’ll make random calls. etc… And they even get paid a couple hundred an HOUR to call you back & talk to you -and they WONT within 3 hours…

You get the example…

The legal industry is much more usurious to the general public. No reform, and no oversight. Think of how hard it is to get some one disbarred (think Duke Attorney Gen) or try to sue for Legal malpractice??? -IT NEVER HAPPENS.

Any contract consultant would work to illustrate this contract is too one sided. How about “I either profit directly from your services, or I owe you nothing for your time except your receipts.” Which is pretty much what your agreement states.

Barry’s… Not that I’m picking on you but to make it a bit more personal… I’m thinking of taking a Real Estate seminar- there are so many out there. It’s very competitive… I want you to sign something like this… Now after we agree, I’ve called your offices a few times and sent a few e-mail questions to you, and I’ve never gotten a reply. -and one time it took you a week. (true examples) Should I demand a refund because you said you would be available for questions and you weren’t?! How ’bout
-if I don’t actually complete a successful short sale with what you’ve taught me I get a refund of the $$ fee minus the paper and the actual copying charge from Kinko’s to produce the 75 page print out and the $10 lunch for 2 days..

I haven’t completed one yet… So I’ll be disputing the credit card fee that was paid to National Real Estate Seminars LLC…

I think accountability is great but you have been writing to many one sided contracts for too long.

What about Sellers and Buyers being liars about the information they give Realtors. That NEVER happens?!?!?! I’ve been surprised by the lengths that a few Seller’s have tried to get out of paying a $20-$60K commission once they have the Buyer’s contact info. With your agreement above -You don’t think they would be a lot of “-Say Mr. Realtor, Well, I talked to Buyer at the grocery store 2 days before they called you.” “So I’m reimbursing you for your newspaper ad and for the 50 mailers and, B-bye, contract… It’s over ‘cuz I’m selling to them and I found them.” “Just ask the Buyer!
Buyer now-
“Yes, Mr. Realtor I’m paying pretty nearly the asking price – less your commission for the house from the owner directly now… What are the odds?” And yes I met them at the grocery store 2 days before the open house, I just couldn’t recall it earlier.”

-Or-

“You didn’t get your phone for 4 hours last Sunday when your wife was in the hospital delivering your baby. The contract is voided.” 3 months later the Realtor finds the guy He brought from the open house to the Buyer -buys the house FSBO…

Hmmm. Just factor those things in… There are many industries that would benefit from better due diligence, good questions and being a smart consumer…

Realtors are just part of the consulting industry.

NOW… GO AFTER LAWYERS!@#$%^!